The universe is a hologram, and our physical brain is just an antenna tuned to the higher dimension of consciousness. Your consciousness exists separately to your body, so if the transporter builds an exact copy of your body (and brain) you will just tune back in to your same consciousness when you’re done transporting.
What drugs aren’t you on? And can I come along?
Dmt probably, and youll have to ask the entities in the waiting room for that
No drugs- just look into holographic universe
Yeah, it’s what’s known as a conspiracy theory with zero evidence
What if the transporter makes an exact copy without destroying the original?
Then the copy gets a new consciousness but has all your memories.
Decoherence swiftly followed by complete cognitive collapse.
The universe is a poop and our physical brain is just a toilet plumped into the higher dimension of consciousness. Your consciousness sits inside of your body like diarrhea in a butt, so if the transporter flushes your consciousness down the doodoo shit pipe, you’ll just fill it up again like toilet water.
Thanks Hugh
Interesting concept. There could be a sci fi story about the brains of two intelligent creatures on vastly distant planets whose brains happen to have the exact same tuning and are attached to the same consciousness, with full awareness of both lives. How they cope with this would be fascinating. On Earth they would probably be considered mentally ill. Or maybe the story is that this is fairly common and is what’s really going on behind a lot of people’s mental problems.
y’know, it is interesting how fear of teleporters is handled but never stigma against teleportees. this hypothetical star trek grandparent is very understanding, but in the early days of the technology i can imagine many people wouldn’t be
Remember Enterprise (the show), and how the Teleporter was only for cargo due to its newness as a technology?.. but one episode they used it on people for an emergency and ended up with debris stuck in their bodies upon rematerialization?
Conspiracy theorists would have a field day
there is true teleportation, dimensional teleporting(in TNG there was one race that had it, but it damages them permanently) but federation never had that kind of technology. which doesnt “disitengrate you”
i am not touching that devil’s elevator as long as i live.
So does everybody else.
Aldebaran’s great, okay,
Algol’s pretty neat,
Betelgeuse’s pretty girls,
Will knock you off your feet.
They’ll do anything you like
Real fast and then real slow,
But if you have to take me apart to get me there
Then I don’t want to go.Take me apart, take me apart,
What a way to roam
And if you have to take me apart to get me there
I’d rather stay at home.Sirius is paved with gold
So I’ve heard it said
By nuts who then go on to say
“See Tau before you’re dead.”
I’ll gladly take the high road
Or even take the low,
But if you have to take me apart to get me there
Then I, for one, won’t go.Take me apart, take me apart,
You must be off your head,
And if you try to take me apart to get me there
I’ll stay right here in bed.Go Stick Your Head In A Pig
I teleported home last night with Ron and Sid and Meg
Ron stole Meggy’s heart away and I got Sidney’s leg.
You mean I don’t have to be conscious anymore? And that a con?
I mean every other thing in life is now just a digital representation of life, why not life. Ascend us damn it.
Murdock? That you Reg?
The philosophical discussions in this thread remind me of Staying Alive (not the song).
Y’know how there’s the DS9 episode of the sniper who teleports bullets? Yea, I would transport my penis into people then beam it back. The medicine will be there, so it will be like some invertebrates who can rip off their penis so the female can use it to impregnate herself. It’s just the obvious move to make moving into the future, obviously.
have the kids ask the grandparent if they voted trump. if so, which it probably is. just means the grandparent is nothing more then a moron with nothing but nonsense and lies for their arguments.
Damn, I was going to ship of Theseus you about the cells in your body replacing themselves constantly, but apparently our brain neurons last a lifetime.
Now I don’t think I would ever use a teleporter, either. Shit.
Just believe we’re inside a simulation and transporters won’t matter.
Its kinda crazy actually if you think about it, our ability to anticipate actions is our ability to land in outcomes expected to be made by the reality generating around us if you imagine the reality outside our bodily sensory input as a big monte carlo field of potentials in the form of intertwined variables…like a big llm.
Aren’t LLMs basically pattern matching systems.
Humans are also pattern matching, and then predicting machines, but with way more inputs and senses than the LLMs.
They don’t match anything but do trigger the “nearest” response to a stimulus, so kinda like pattern matching but that implies doing it on purpose. But yeah the rest I agree with.
Will they anti matter then?
That is why nervous system damage usually means life long problems. Brains and all their wiring are so arcane and complicated, even our bodies don’t know how to grow more than one of them, and we often don’t get it right the first time either unfortunately.
Well clearly you didn’t get it right.
muscle cells too. the muscle cells you have now are the same cells you had as a kid (not entirely sure how far back it goes). they dont even divide when you gain muscle, the cells just get bigger and absorb nuclei from neighboring cells to support the extra mass. the cool thing is the nuclei stick around even if you let the muscles atrophy, so theyre forever changed by having once been big. thats probably part of why its easier to get back to muscle size youve been at before.
But what about the atoms/molecules that make up those neurons? Do they last a lifetime?
So far that we know of, neural cell DNA, tooth enamel, and eye lens crystallines, never have their atoms replaced.
Which is to say that we are a ship of theseus, and a transporter does not kill us. The only reason these atoms are not normally replaced is because there is no natural mechanism to replace them.
Radiocarbon Dating of the Human Eye Lens Crystallines Reveal Proteins without Carbon Turnover throughout Life Lynnerup N, Kjeldsen H, Heegaard S, Jacobsen C, Heinemeier J (2008) Radiocarbon Dating of the Human Eye Lens Crystallines Reveal Proteins without Carbon Turnover throughout Life. PLOS ONE 3(1): e1529. https://doi.org/10.1371/journal.pone.0001529
Not sure I would tie my identity to my neuron DNA, tooth enamel, and eye lens crystallines. Definitely agree with you that we are living ships of Theseus. I’m pretty sure there’s no natural mechanism to replace those parts because it’s really hard, and we work “well enough” without being able to.
Yun Tianming: am I joke to you?
Yeah but we don’t know if consciousness lives in the meat or in the chemistry.
A distinction between a teleporter and a transporter…
To teleport implies the original matter is instantly moved from one place to another so there would be no destruction and reconstituted copy. A wormhole would seem to be the only realistic way that could be achieved.
A transporter, well that means copy then kill. No one knows if the kill part is painful because noone survives it. I find it funny Riker’s copy is actually the “original” and his lack of death is considered a transporter accident. Yet he is the one treated like the copy…
And all that said, barclay’s experience in the transporter beam is more suggestive of a wormhole style device.
I don’t know why I bothered to write all this out…
A transporter is just Jason Statham in a suit. SCNR
Someone needs to. At least you put thought into it.
Iirc Thomas is not Will’s copy. Basically the transporter has a malfunction where Thomas and Will are both constituted on a transporter pad. So both are the “original” and also both are neither. In a sense, the William Thomas Riker who stepped onto that pad that day ceased to be, forked into two different lives.
I used to use this episode to talk about identity when I taught ethics back in the day. Both men carried on their lives under the belief that they were the same man who stepped onto a transporter pad on Nervala IV. Their experiences defined who they were, demonstrating that it’s more than biological material that makes any one of us us.
Now the deeper question is: since you can’t add matter to the universe, what’s missing to give life to two Rikers?
The energy that was used in the original teleportation. I didn’t think it was that deep, it used more energy to reconstitute more matter.
Sounds like trek had the technology to copy people. You would think if they are sending people out into the unknown to explore galaxies light years away they would just send a copy. Or at least keep a copy.
I wonder what earth piccard would be up to…
Just copy Data everywhere.
You know what, now that your mention it, wasn’t the explanation that the signal was reflected back to the surface due to the ionising radiation of something, so the beam was kinda split or doubled. So my premise was wrong.
Yeah. They tried to split the beam to account for the radiation, half of it made it through, the other half mirrored back. I’m guessing the computer can extrapolate the remaining matter based off of data saved in the pattern buffer?
Either way, Thomas Riker was way under-utilized in Star Trek. I also love how “okay, sure” everyone is about this situation.
I assume they sent a lot more data than it takes to make a single person. Eventually enough data for a whole Ryker was received at each location, while a lot more data got scattered.
The are other methods from Star Trek that could potentially be size as well.
Like “hey you actually travel through this other dimension where your physical form is undisturbed and no time passes in this dimension”
Which sounds ok, but “by the way it’s kinda a hell-dimension and your consciousness gets tortured for a distance-relative time there but won’t retain the memories after…”
Stop giving your time to corporations! W this, T that. They have played us for absolute fools, there is no need for economy class.
Seize the means of eldritchticity production comrade, don’t believe any nonsense about colors. The trains are always on time under the F co-op too.
Oh dear lord. Yeah I could definitely see a variant where the hell dimension is just “work all the hours that it would have taken to traverse in normal space so that EvilCorp can generate profit for the pan-dimensional empire”
To transport just means to move, so if anything the term “transporter” implies physically moving people rather than copying. The term “teleport” is the more ambiguous one…
In this case transporter is more ambiguous not because of the literal meaning, but the association with a particular technology.
I’m glad you did.
his lack of death is considered a transporter accident
Must do wonders for his self worth! 😄
They both got converted into energy, Thomas is just as much a copy as Will. Also, apparently your experience is constant across the process, as seen by Barclay grabbing someone out of the matter stream. Presumably someone would notice if it hurt…
Isn’t Tom just another copy? He came out of the pattern buffer the same as Will iirc.
Yet he is the one treated like the copy…
no matter what, they were like 1000th generation of copies. “the original” died when riker stepped into the transporter for the first time. so discussing whether this one is 1001st, or 1002nd generation seems not that exciting…
Well, no, “transporter” means the first one, because that’s how they’re explained to work where they’re called transporters.
Now I understand why such and such movie about magicians calls the trick “the transported man”.
I would be the guy who says, “Open-source teleporters only.”
I ain’t risking having myself modified surreptitiously. 😑
uses teleporter
is inexplicably desperate to try the New Improved Coca Cola
In that case if you’re a union leader, you just get deleted
No worries, its not you that was modified its your clone. Youre dead!
But if they were open source they’d have the worst name possibly, and possibly an equally awful UI.
I guess we can be glad that “the GIMP” is taken so nobody will reuse that for a future FOSSeporter
- Bob’s Alternate Teleport Engine - A reimplementation of the standard protocol.
- Ben’s Unified Teleporter Template Placed Largely Under Ground - You do need to dig a big hole, but the result is very neat, with just the teleport pad and controls showing.
- Complex Linear Indoor Teleporter - Works like a corridor, letting you just walk from one building to another.
For number 2 there’s a derivative which can also vibrate, which is said to make the process much more pleasant. Oh and it’s entirely built out of rust, nobody really knows why though.
The faster you walk into number three, the sooner you reach the destination.
But you need to have the endurance to make it to the end.
The first one wouldn’t have a ui, it’d be a Unix-style command, probably called tsck, or killu or something.
FOSSeporter makes it sound like everyone is dancing lol
The important part is to start with the acronym and then try and figure out what it can stand for.
Yes. The H.R.U.M.F. principle!
My grandma won’t drive on the interstate. These are the same.
Quite reasonable. “Driven the back roads so I wouldn’t get waylaid.”
Is it waylaid or weighed, as in driving over a scale at a inspection station?
Edit: lyrics all say “weighed”, but the way it’s sung over two beats I definitely hear waylaid. Truckers hauling overweight loads, or heavier than reported on the bill of lading (contraband), don’t want to have to go over the scales because they’ll get caught.
We always sung it as waylaid. As in stopped by the PoPo. The song also speaks of transporting “smokes and folks”, so yeah, behave in a way that keeps one from ever talking to the authorities.
Yes thank you I agree that is what waylaid means. The lyrics however, are “weighed” as in pulling into a weigh station you usually see along the highway closed for some reason.
My mom wouldn’t drive on the freeway because she lacked confidence. It was too fast for her. She was fine riding with dad driving, though.
